Thursday, August 30, 2012

Paul Ryan: An engaging fibber

Updated, 2:30 p.m.: Vice presidential nominee Paul Ryan gave the most energizing speech thus far of the Republican National Convention on Wednesday. Unfortunately, it was filled with fibs and misleading statements.

Ryan was unquestionably an effective attack dog. "They've run out of ideas. Their moment came and went. ... With all their attack ads, the president is just throwing away money. And he's pretty experienced at that," Ryan said to an awakened crowd.

The most notable thing about Ryan's speech, however, was how free he felt to stretch the truth and leave out obvious context. We've seen that tactic in 30-second TV ads from both sides, but for a party's vice presidential nominee to do so on the biggest stage of the campaign was stark.

The web is filled today with analyses breaking down Ryan's speech. We'll save you some time and effort and just summarize a handful of the most misleading things we heard (and we'll do the same when the Democrats come to Charlotte next week):




  • The stretch: Ryan said Obama promised to keep a GM plant in Janesville, Wisconsin open, but that plant is now closed. The truth: GM decided to close the plant in December 2008, when George W. Bush was president. And Ryan opposed Obama's GM bailout, which is now widely credited with saving the company and the industry.


  • The stretch: Ryan said the Bowles-Simpson debt reduction commission sent Obama "an urgent report" that he then ignored. The truth: Obama certainly ignored Simpson-Bowles. But Ryan himself was on the commission and voted against the Simpson-Bowles plan. The lack of support by Ryan and others on the commission relieved Congress of having to act on it.


  • The stretch: Ryan referred to "$716 billion, funneled out of Medicare by President Obama," saying it came "at the expense of the elderly." The truth: Obama's cuts to Medicare do not reduce benefits to seniors. They reduce future reimbursement rates to hospitals and insurance plans. And they haven't happened; they take place over 10 years. Ryan included the same cuts in his budget plan. In fact, Ryan's Medicare plan reduces spending on the program more than Obama did.


  • The stretch: Ryan blamed Obama for the S&P downgrade of America's credit rating. The truth: The downgrade happened because Republicans in Congress took the nation to the brink over raising the debt ceiling. In its downgrade after that showdown, S&P blamed Republicans in Congress, like Ryan, who "continue to resist any measure that would raise revenues."


Neil Newhouse, a pollster for the Romney campaign, this week said: “We’re not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers.” And Paul Ryan proves it.



-- Taylor Batten




65 comments:

Exit 0 said...

So, basically, Mr. Newhouse is saying "we're gonna lie our butts off."

Is that it?

27d0a8ac-2523-11e1-aeb2-000bcdcb2996 said...

The truth-Obama has added $5 trillion to the national debt in an out of control budget which was the real reason for the S&P Downgrade.

The truth-Senate majority Demos (and fsckless Harry Reid) would not consider Bowles Simpson or ANY OTHER budget (for 3 years).

The truth-The Obama admin gave $40 plus billion to the auto industry, most of which remains outstanding. Unions were bailed out at the expense of bondholders.

Address the real facts, Mr. Batten and you might gain some credibity.

Unknown said...

Typical biased, liberal garbage from the left-wing Observer. Really can't expect anything better out of them.

Rob said...

Per the Janesville Gazette, the final shutdown of assembly operations at the GM Janesville plant was April 23, 2009: http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2009/apr/21/thursday-last-day-production-isuzu-line-comes-end/

This is months after Obama took office.

Unknown said...

Maybe if you would call out the fibber in chief once in a while people might take what you write seriously. You need to apply for a job at the DNC. Wait, you do work for an arm of it....

Jim said...

Well, Mr. Batten, I guess you've got the choir breathing heavily and feeling tingles all up and down their legs this morning.

Chief said...

Hey Rob, that was just a skeleton crew that was putting out the last existing orders that had already been placed prior to December 2008. You can google to find local Wisconsin TV news reports from 2008 where they were reporting on the employees saying goodbye on their final day on the job.

And let's even assume that this Paul Ryan lie was truth: If we can blame Obama for something that happened when he had been in office for 3 months, does that mean we should have blamed Bush for 9/11?

Alexander said...

Who will fact check the fact checkers? See here http://gazettextra.com/news/2009/apr/21/thursday-last-day-production-isuzu-line-comes-end/ and here http://www.jsonline.com/business/130171578.html for the proof that the Janesville facility was shut down in 2009.

Alexander said...

Another less than engaging fib by Mr. Batten. What Paul Ryan said about Obama ignoring the Simpson-Bowles commission is true. So why can't Paul Ryan point that out? He certainly can't rely upon the Observer and the rest of the MSM to do so.

george woelfel said...

Prez Bush left office with a deficit near 11 trillion and still counting...counting on Obama to get blamed for the 5 trillion added by a run amok GOP agenda on the Democratic watch.The GOP gave Bush 8 years to destroy our economy but expect a black man to fix it with just a half a chance(4 yrs.) Being a world traveler this economy isn't getting fixed by replacing a President its getting fixed by a united America finally getting off its conservative lazy fat ass and making some progressive moves to retain economical dominance. This GOP reminds me of the American Loyalists Party back when America was seeking Independence from Britain. The Loyalist were loyal to The King of England and his fat cats and frightened by the idea of Washington,Jefferson,Adams.Franklin moving progressively toward America's Independence...The GOP are those same cowards.They'd rather be slaves to industry and succumb to the wealthy's dogma.COWARDS!!!

Alexander said...

Wow, it gets even worse for Mr. Batten. Paul Ryan was was correct to say that $716 billion was funneled out of Medicare by President Obama. Even Batten refers to this as "Obama's cuts to Medicare" but then defends them by saying they do not reduce benefits to seniors. I will leave for another day the explanation to Mr. Batten about the economic response to reducing payments for services (hint: you get less of it). But, defending Obama's cuts to Medicare (which until now the Observer never bothered to inform its readers) does not in any way make what Mr. Ryan said untrue.

Rob said...

@Chief: I'm merely stating the facts. The author said that Ryan had lied on when the plant closed, I provided the truth that it had closed when Ryan said it did.

There's no sense in you setting up a straw man argument to shift the discussion away from the fact that the author was wrong, although one could suggest that he did lie. But, it could well be that he is merely ignorant instead of being a liar.

Chief said...

Alexander and Rob, do you and other commenters even read the other comments? Here is the direct link to the plant workers saying goodbye the day before Christmas Eve 2008 under Bush's watch: http://gazettextra.com/news/2008/dec/23/goodbyeand-thanks/

john law said...

"You" now the fact checker, after being derelict and missing in action for 4 years, ...glad your afraid of Ryan, you should be.

Chief said...

The point of this story Rob is to not believe whatever Michelle Malkin or El Rushbo tell you.

Alexander said...

Wow, Mr. (Chalian) Batten saved his worst for last. S&P lowered our sovereign debt rating due to "the rising public debt burden and [S&P's] perception of greater policymaking uncertainty." S&P did not blame the Republicans in Congress. Moreover, the policymaking uncertainty they referred to was ascribed by S&P to the inability of Congress and the Obama Administration to forge "a broader fiscal consolidation plan that stabilizes the government's debt dynamics." One house in Congress has passed such a plan (the Republican House). One house in Congress has not passed a budget in 3 years (the Democratic Senate). Our President has presented budgets in each of the last 2 years that has received not one single vote in favor, a plan that even Erskine Bowles referred to as not serious.

Alexander said...

Chief:

You need to read the April 21, 2009 edition of the Janesville Gazette. See here: http://gazettextra.com/news/2009/apr/21/thursday-last-day-production-isuzu-line-comes-end/.

Bottom line: GM shut down the last assembly line in Janesville at end of April 2009.

catron said...

Mr. Batten, where are you getting your "facts"? Amazing how a "newspaper editorialist" can be so wrong. Show some courage and backbone and stand up for truth someday! Democratic Party Propaganda!!! Are you willing to take this country and economy over the cliff for your "facts"? Obama only knows how to SPEND money! Sure Medicare takes reimbursements away from doctors and hospitals - now 20% less and Obamacare will take another 25% away from doctors and hospitals AND tell doctors how to treat patients depending on cost. Would you treat Medicare patients at 45% less reimbursement? Ryan leaves it as is for 10 years so that senior can then decide (with credit from government for premium) what plan he wants including choice for same plan as congressional members or another private plan. Your other "facts" are also wrong!!!!! How can you look yourself in the mirror?

Adolf said...

Fibber? How about laying it out with straight talk. He is a liar. A career politician. Totally incapable of offering any real solutions, only ideology.

Andrew said...

The real question here is if Taylor will man up and admit that he at the last got the first stretched truth analysis wrong. The auto bailout hasn't been a success, i mean unless you're saying taxpayers losing $30billion is a success.
http://reason.com/blog/2012/08/30/ryans-fact-challenged-fact-checkers

Point 2. You admit he is right, but are also saying he's not telling the truth. Slimy.

On point 3. Taylor what do you think happens when reimbursement rates to hospitals and insurance plans are reduced by over $700b? If your answer is reduced services you would have connected the dots successfully. Ryans proposed budget does change Medicare so that its still around in 50 years. Otherwise it will be bankrupt much sooner.

Point 4. The house passed a bill raising the debt ceiling earlier in July. Who blocked it? The democrats in the senate. And this would probably be a mute point if Obama had cut the deficit in half like he promised. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/jul/20/nation/la-na-debt-talks-20110720

Your move Taylor.

Wiley Coyote said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
jcmack said...

I'm wondering if Taylor Betton is going to do the same thing on Obama and Biden. How they have lied to us, and stretched the truth so far out you can't even find any facsimile of the truth anywhere. 4 Years debt has gone up almost doubled, 1 in 5 receive some kind of gov't aide, 100 million are on some kind of welfare. Really, is this the hope and change? You who voted for them, had a lot of hope and all you are left with is a little bit of change in your pocket going jingle lingle ling!

Wiley Coyote said...

..We'll be waiting for your article next week called "Barack Obama, An engaging fibber"...

Archiguy said...

Amazing how the angry Republican enablers - legion on this board - have created an entire alternate reality to justify anything one of their politicians says.

Of course Republicans lie. (And no, the Democrats are not remotely the same.) They have to lie and distort the facts - to create their own reality - in order to get people to vote for them. Thus, their war on professional journalists, the mainstream media, and anyone else who would dare call them on their whoppers. You see it right here.

Of course Ryan lied. Mitt will stand up there tonight and lie as well. But you have to ask yourself, if the only way they can get people to vote for them is to lie their pasty white tushies off, how can you possibly trust them to govern the country honestly? Anybody remember Iraq's WMD's? Nah, of course not. They took this entire country to war and killed 5,000 of it's sons and daughters for that one. And we didn't even get the oil they were after.

Being a Republican politician means never having to say you're sorry, never having to say you're wrong, never having to tell the truth. After all, truth is whatever you say it is, and they have an entire "news" network as well as the entire AM radio band as their official propaganda arm. Watch tonight and see how brazen they are about it.

No_clue777 said...

Those of you waiting for a hard hitting opinion piece about the Democrats lying or stretching the truth already know you will never see it from this "opinion board." Wait to see the glowing articles about the President next week. I can almost smell it getting deep.....

Alexander said...

Archiguy,

Two words for you--David Chalian. Google him.

jcmack said...

Ya I know we will never see an article in the observer how the dems lie and stretch the truth. That's just a given. Smell it getting deep? I've been standing in it for 4 long years!
To Archiguy, no one is angry. We are just voicing our opinion. I guess it is alright when libs voice theirs but when conservatives do, oh watch out, we might start a revolution. You know those tea partiers. Just in amazement.

No_clue777 said...

Archiguy,

You really need to get on this papers "editorial board".....you would fit right in......the fact that you believe your party and candidates are pure as the driven snow shows just how ignorant you really are.

Jody Roy said...

How all you right-wing liars can come out and support this right-winger liar with your constant right-wing lies...this is how Republicans are destroying this country. They started with Bush, they can't admit that he was a train wreck and ruined this country's economy, they've done nothing but obstruct this President since he took office, and now they want to take over again to finish their destruction of this country. Traitors, all of you.

Richard said...

I'm still waiting for you to publish the rest which I assume you feel is true. I'll also be looking for this type of article bashing Obama during the DNC. I know, I know. Hell would have to freeze over.

Alexander said...

Jody,

The Sell-By date for blaming George Bush for everything has long since past. Mitt Romney worked with a Massachusetts legislature dominated by Democrats and managed to balance their state budget without raising taxes. Why can't President Obama do the same?

Archiguy said...

The fact is that when Republicans whine and scream about how biased the mainstream media is, that's just code for "they don't agree with me, they don't agree with Rush, they don't agree with Sean, or Sarah, or any of the hundreds of other paid propagandists for the GOP that I've been told to trust above all others.

They've been trained to act this way in the hope that they'll intimidate the media to fall in line. Too many times that's happened but fortunately for Charlotte, not here, not yet. After all, as Dubya once said "If you're not with us, you're against us." All these hysterical posts slamming the newspaper (mostly by freeloaders who don't subscribe, no doubt) make that all too clear.

The mainstream media is neither with you nor against you. Their job is to report the FACTS. Not the ones that are made up by your officially approved propagandists, but the actual, real, demonstrable, evidence-based facts that occur in THIS universe. That's what's being done in this article, and your reactions are entirely predictable and sadly typical. And you're not fooling anyone.

Alexander said...

Archiguy,

Just recently, Politico reporter Joe Williams said on MSNBC that Mitt Romney was comfortable only among white people. He was suspended and left Politico.

Just recently, Brian Ross of ABC News, with the prompting of former Clinton political advisor George Stephanopolous, identified on-air that the Aurora shooter was a member of the Tea Party.

Yesterday, Yahoo Washington Bureau Chief (and former ABC Political Director) David Chalian was fired for saying that Romney and the Republicans “are happy to have a party with black people drowning.”

And that is just scratching the surface.

jcmack said...

Jody,
Is that the best you can do is name call? Spoken like a true lib. Name call so no one looks here. Do the statistics, run the numbers do you really feel better off from 4 years ago? Honestly? Do you have more dollar bills in your pocket than change? I mean come on even the price of spam has gone up 75 cents a can in a year! Really? If you say you are better off then you yourself are a liar. If that you are a liar, that would mean you are also lied about Republicans being a liar which would mean Republicans are not a liar. Can you follow that one?
Personally I see the US spiralling downward with our current Prez. Going deeper and deeper into a socialist nation. Even in Europe the socialist countries agree that socialism does not work. Russia is more of a capatalist nation than we are now. It's time to bring the country back to the way it should be and was intended.
JFK said it best during his moon speech and we can take this and move it into this era.
"We choose to go to the moon. We choose to go to the moon... (interrupted by applause) we choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too."
This did not mean lets wait and have the gov't give us hand outs but to do things that strenthen the US. The US was built on peoples hard work. Not from sitting at home. We can not afford another 4 years of the same. We can not keep piling debt on debt. We can not continue to have so many out of work. We can not wait.

TexGirl said...

If their job is to report facts, why aren't they doing it? Do they have to wait for their bosses in the Obama campaign to give the ok?

J said...

I realize this is a blog, not an article, and it's an opinion blog at that, but if this is what passes for journalism these days, there is little hope for the profession.

"we'll do the same when the Democrats come to Charlotte next week"

If you expect me to believe that, you genuinely think I am very stupid. It is obvious that you are a Democrat and fully supportive of the Democrat Party platform. There's nothing wrong with that. But given your allegiance, and the fact that both parties consider the other party their sworn enemy, do you honestly expect me to believe that you will cast the same critical eye on your friends that you do on your enemies? C'mon, Taylor. I'm an intelligent man; I know better than that.

Now, about some of the "stretches" and "truths"...

I don't care about the semantics of whether Bush or Obama was President when the Janesville plant closed. Ryan's point was that Obama stood in front of the plant and promised to prevent or reverse plant closings like that one. Ryan simply called Obama on the fact that he hasn't accomplished that. And all this nonsense about Obama being "widely credited with saving GM and the auto industry?" The only people giving that wide credit are the union goons - oh, I'm sorry, I mean union executives - who still have their jobs. Bank of America has paid back ALL of its bailout money, plus interest. GM and Chrysler are nowhere near paying thiers back.

I don't fault any member of Congress, Democrat or Republican, for trying to get stimulus money for his/her constituents. The stimulus was a stupid idea, but once Obama & Pelosi rammed it down our throats, each Rep likely reasoned, since it's been forced on us, I may as well make sure my district gets a cut. For all Obama's bloviating about how every evil under the sun is George W. Bush's fault, he used a Bush tactic to revive the economy. Or does no one remember that Bush asked for, and got, two stimulus programs, neither of which accomplished anything?

And the credit downgrade? Well, as a devoted liberal, you likely agree with the liberal view that EVERY problem can be ONLY be solved through government spending programs and punitive tax increases on everyone on Earth who makes more money than you do. That would explain how you believe that cutting even 1 penny of government spending and opposing further tax increases during the debt ceiling negotiation is evil.

I'll be checking the Observer website frequently next week to see if you indeed call out Democrats on their bloviating the way you are doing the Republicans on theirs. I will not hold my breath.

kantstanzya said...

Wow. The panic of the mainstream media is evident in these Taylor Batten misstatements.One can tell he is upset with the effectiveness of the Ryan speech.

Each of the "stretches" is easily disputed or at least has two sides with Ryan's interpretation being just as reasonable as the other. But Mr. Batten's biggest whopper is about the GM plant.

Yes the plant was targeted for closing initially in the fall of 2008. But B. Obama specifically told the people on at least two occasions while campaigning he would keep it open. Even CNN has backtracked from that initial claim that what Ryan said was false. When it was closed Obama owned GM and could do whatever he wanted to.

Mr. Newhouse in saying the campaign would not be dictated to by "fact checkers" obviously meant they would not be afraid to put out their message and the facts because of the resulting propaganda from the "fact checkers" working for the liberal media. The GOP continues to treat people as being more intelligent that the Dems give them credit for.

This is good news. The left is in panic mode, continuing to do Obama's dirty work, but cannot figure out how to attack and destroy Paul Ryan and his family personally as they did to Sarah Palin. They are actually having to argue the facts for a change!

J said...

Jody Roy,

You are absolutely wrong about true Republicans. True Republicans' opinion of Bush isn't a lot higher than yours. Most of us consider him a RINO (Republican In Name Only) for the massive amount of debt he accumulated, for expanding the size of government (there is no good reason whey Homeland Security can't be part of the Deparment of Defense instead of its own bloated bureaucracy), and for botching the Afghan/Iraq war, which we should have finished with ease long ago.

And how did Republicans distract this President from Jan. 2009-Nov 2010? The Dems had the White House, a large majority in the House and a fillibuster-proof majority in the Senate. So what did he do? Got a stimulus bill that didn't work, just like the 2 Bush stimulus bills didn't (and if everything is Bush's fault, why did he use a failed Bush solution to the problem?), and rammed a healthcare "reform" bill down our throat that we didn't even ask for. At that point, with 22 months in office with a compliant legislative branch, he had done nothing but blame others, attempt to solve a problem with a solution that had already failed, and spent more time on an issue that was not the #1 issue the country was facing. That is all on him and his fellow Democrats. There weren't enough Republicans to mount any distractions or roadblocks that couldn't be run over.

BiBr said...

Taylor: I anxiously await your list of lies that the DNC speakers will produce. Please be fair and impartial (which has always been a bit of a problem for you and your co-workers).

Andy said...

So what have we learned here? Who will check the fact checkers...

1) The GM Plant closed in 2009, here's the links:
http://gazettextra.com/news/2009/apr/21/thursday-last-day-production-isuzu-line-comes-end/ and here

http://www.jsonline.com/business/130171578.html for the proof that the Janesville facility was shut down in 2009.

2) It's TRUE that Obama ignored Simpson/Bowles - that was the accusation that was made - Ryan voted against it as well, but the reason he did so was because he had his own budget plan...which Obama ALSO rejected.

3) While you can argue what the cuts will affect in Medicare, Ryan's statement that Obama took $716 million from Medicare is entirely true. So what happens if you take $716 million from doctor's and hospital's reimbursements for care? Reduced services maybe?

4) S&P lowered our sovereign debt rating due to "the rising public debt burden and [S&P's] perception of greater policymaking uncertainty." S&P did not blame the Republicans in Congress. Moreover, the policymaking uncertainty they referred to was ascribed by S&P to the inability of Congress and the Obama Administration to forge "a broader fiscal consolidation plan that stabilizes the government's debt dynamics." One house in Congress has passed such a plan (the Republican House). One house in Congress has not passed a budget in 3 years (the Democratic Senate). Our President has been presented budgets in each of the last 2 years. Here's also a link to where the republican house passed a debt ceiling increase which was blocked by the democratic senate: http://articles.latimes.com/2011/jul/20/nation/la-na-debt-talks-20110720

Chloe said...

I have read all the analysis on the web today regardingthe Ryan speech. Andy, thank you for your thoughtful comments.

Ian Kuhn said...

Andy...

The plant was scheduled to close before the end of 2008. If the 2nd Mate was dubbed Captain of the Titanic at 2 am on April 15, 1912, would you hold him responsible for the sinking of the ship? From what I can gather...you would.

Archiguy said...

The FACT is the plant did close for all intensive purposes at the end of '08. The only people left there in April when President Obama spoke were a skeleton crew involved in minor tasks related to the shutdown. What Ryan tried to do is to blame the President for the plant's closing - a blatantly misleading statement. But as been covered, that's what Republican politicians do. And their clueless acolytes - like these people here - parrot the lies as if they were mother's milk.

Good grief. We need a fact checker for these comment boards. Honestly guys, you really aren't fooling anyone, and you're not going to intimidate the Observer editorial staff into becoming a print version of Fox News. Those of us who actually PAY for the newspaper won't let that happen.

So you might as well do something more productive with your time. Hey - the cafeteria is open with the early bird special! Better log off and get a move on. All this hysteria about the "left wing media" has got to make you hungry for some "freedom fries", eh?

Garth Vader said...

GM "saved"? The facts are:

* Government purchases of GM vehicles are up 78%. So taxpayers are giving GM money from every direction.

* GM is using "units shipped from factory" as its sales metric rather than "units sold by dealers". This is a dishonest/borderline-illegal practice known as "channel stuffing" that makes the company's sales look better than they really are. Dealer inventories are high across the country.

* GM has once again shut down production of the Volt because of lack of demand.

* GM is seeking an additional $8-10 billion line of credit. The lenders are Citigroup, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, Morgan Stanley, Royal Bank of Canada and UBS. So when GM defaults on that, it will lead to another taxpayer bailout of the banking mafia.

I'm not voting for Romney/Ryan (Ryan's budget plan doesn't balance until 2040 and it has impossible-to-reach GDP growth assumptions), but the GM bailout is one of the worst taxpayer ripoffs ever perpetrated.

Double Deac said...

The decision to close Isuzu production at the Janesville plant was made in June 2008 according to the link people here are using to criticize Obama.

The same article says that one of GM's shifts at the plant had already been eliminated leading to approximately 2,000 lost jobs. GM had hoped to keep the other shift going until 2010, but was forced to eliminate all GM production at the plant in December 2008.

We can argue about the day the lights went out in the plant, but GM was done there in 2008. For years prior, GM and Chrysler had been in tailspin. Near St. Louis, where I was living in the mid-2000s, Chrysler was closed its Fenton plants building Rams and minivans. Thousands were laid off.

Today, GM is again the largest car maker in the world and Chrysler made its first profit in more than a decade. While not all the money used to bailout these companies will ever be fully repaid directly, much of the money has been paid back. When I think of the hundreds of billions we have spent in Iraq and Afghanistan, I think it is sad that people cite the cost of the auto bailouts as unpalatable.

Personally, spending a fraction of the amount spend in Iraq and Afghanistan to preserve hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of auto jobs and auto-related jobs through the worst economic decline in 80 years is well worth the cost.

Double Deac said...

Here's what Ryan said in Ohio: "You know, I live in Janesville, Wisconsin. We used to have a big General Motors plant. A lot of my high school buddies worked at that plant. That plant was shut down in 2009. I remember President Obama visiting it when he was first running, saying he'll keep that plant open. One more broken promise.

"We used to build Tahoes and Suburbans. One of the reasons that plant got shut down was $4 gasoline. You see, this costs jobs. The president's terrible energy policies are costing us jobs.

"So a lot of my buddies that I grew up with, friends of mine from high school, they're out of this job. You know a lot of them thought that they could have a job at the plant downtown, just like their folks did and make a good living, provide for their families, have a good future. And now they're out of work."

Clearly, he is equating the loss of the jobs at the GM plant with President Obama's energy policies. The problem with this reasoning is that President Obama wasn't President at the time.

Further, what Obama said was not that he would "save" the plant. He said that if the government supported GM to retool the plant, then it would be there in a hundred years. Clearly, Obama is saying that American manufacturing can work. We can debate whether American manufacturing requires government assistance as Obama argues, but it is pretty hard to reconcile his statement with the "promise" alleged by Ryan and writers on this board.

All statements can be found here, which is the paper of record for Janesville: http://gazettextra.com/news/2012/aug/28/gm-plant-becomes-political-football/

jcmack said...

Did everyone forget that Obama said that gas should be $5 a gallon? That is one thing I am glad he did not make happen.

Larry Comrades said...

So the Observer is going to dissect the things politicians are going to say and judge them fairly.

Thanks Observer we all know you will be just as fair and balanced as you can be.

MarkB said...

Fascinating that the Observer repeats the talking points from the Democrats.

firedup said...

EVERY major news site reported on Paul's lies today. Faux News' opinion piece was one of the best!

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/

You can hate Democrats and their policies but you can't make stuff up just for kicks.

Laser Guided Loogie said...

Why do yo think that because Obama pledge to leave the jacksonville plant open, and then didn't that Ryan shouldn't have called him on it? Just because he voted (rightly so) against the bailout?


He was right in both cases.


Also, you are wrong that the bailout "saved" GM. GM is going bankrupt again, even after moving those factories to China with taxpayer money.


All the bailout did was postpone the inevitable.


Ryan was right, you are wrong.

-Ken

Larry Comrades said...

Hey where is the banner for the RNC like the DNC for posting these stories under. The Observer seems to have only one special banner.

Any reason why, no wait I think we might like to know anyway.

John said...

At least he's "engaging" which is more that can be said for the Observer editorial staff who does more than their share of "fibbing"!

BTW, don't you think it was inappropriate of S&P playing obvious partisan politics with the downgrade of the US debt rating? What did they expect? For Republicans who had just been elected based upon anger with Obama's policies to roll over and play dead to the dictatorial demands of the administration that voters had just reacted to?

It was S&P that was fibbing, not Ryan!

Phil said...

Taylor Batten, UNC school of Journalism. Got D's and F's but pushed to the A and B list. That what the CO said.

firedup said...

@ Larry Comrades - Yes, we all know the DNC convention is being held here and the local paper is highlighting that fact. CO will add an RNC banner when they choose Charlotte as the host city. Understand?

Patriot said...

The author states that it was decide the plant would close in 2008. The plant did not officially close until 2009, but it was planned to be closed before Obama took office. You can find this information online, as well as the S&P report stating that the reason for the credit downgrade (Republicans refusal to raise government revenues, and congress not being able to agree on raising the debt ceiling, also caused by the Republicans). You right-wingers always throw up your hands and name call; stomp your feet and kick your heels every time the facts don't favor your side. But you always seem to be to lazy to actually look up any facts, and would prefer to just have information that is more to your liking spoon fed to you by the yellow journalists at Fox News and the like. Yes, most media outlets are biased. It's not some kind of secret conspiracy theory, and that's why you actually need to do some research yourself. Also, if you think that the downgrade helped the democrats in some way, then you really have no common sense.

Double Deac said...

Yes, as to what Larry Comrades writes, why does the CO so prominently cover the Bobcats and Panthers? Clearly there is a bias. I demand banners for the Bulls and Giants!

We would really like to know!

Larry Comrades said...

Sports is more important than republicans, good point.

Larry Comrades said...

Plus the observer would have to pay extra money to do anything special for the republicans and since so many in Charlotte are not anymore, why even bother.

Jim said...

"If media "fact checkers" are just impartial guardians of the truth, how come they got their own facts wrong about Paul Ryan's speech, and did so in a way that helped President Obama's re-election effort?"

Source: Investors.com, 8-30-12

Google for the details. This piece of O-pinion perpetuates the misstatements of fact identified in the article.

Thanks, Taylor!

Bill said...

Add another one to the Lyin' Ryan's list of false statements:

Last week, Ryan claimed he had run a "two fifty-something" marathon.

This is a very impressive time and Runners World wanted to do a story on him. Turns out, Lyin' Ryan has only run a 4+ hour marathong.

The Ryan campaign ignored repeated attempts for clarification until late Friday night. They admitted that Ryan was again telling an outright lie.

SCBORN said...

1) The stretch: Ryan said Obama promised to keep a GM plant in Janesville, Wisconsin open, but that plant is now closed.
Answer: "And I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years. The question is not whether a clean energy economy is in our future, it’s where it will thrive. I want it to thrive right here in the United States of America; right here in Wisconsin; and that’s the future I’ll fight for as your president."
He was President when his administration ran GM through a convoluted bankruptcy process in which his administration picked all kinds of winners and losers: Bond holders, Unions, Plants and dealerships that GM wanted closed were kept open by the administration. So YES, Obama said ”as President” which he was at the time, and his administration (“government”) chose to “support” others beside this plant in WI when he could have.
2) The stretch: Ryan said the Bowles-Simpson debt reduction commission sent Obama "an urgent report" that he then ignored.
Answer: This is a clear and true statement. What Ryan did or didn’t do had NOTHING to do with what Obama did, NOTHING! He could have taken up the challenge, but refused.
3) The stretch: Ryan referred to "$716 billion, funneled out of Medicare by President Obama," saying it came "at the expense of the elderly."
Answer: It certainly may come at the expense of the elderly. When you reduce payments to providers they tend to provide less. Don’t belive me? Well here is what the trustee for Medicare said:
“In the Office of the Actuary‘s April 22, 2010 memorandum on the estimated financial effects of the Affordable Care Act, we noted that by 2019 the update reductions would result in negative total facility margins for about 15 percent of hospitals, skilled nursing facilities, and home health agencies. This estimated percentage would continue to increase, reaching roughly 25 percent in 2030 and 40 percent by 2050. In practice, providers could not sustain continuing negative margins and, absent legislative changes, would have to withdraw from providing services to Medicare beneficiaries, merge with other provider groups, or shift substantial portions of Medicare costs to their non-Medicare, non-Medicaid payers.”
Clearly benefits and access may very well be affected—“at the expense of the elderly”
4) The stretch: Ryan blamed Obama for the S&P downgrade of America's credit rating
Answer: EVERY Chairman and CEO gets blamed for the down grade. Downgrades happen for many reasons, including lack of leadership!

thinkingconservative said...

As my father would say-"No wonder the country is going to hell in a handbasket"
Fox heads open your minds to the truth & facts. Georgie expanded the deficit by 5-7 trillion. Own it.

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